Half Giant - Sentinel

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Substancekill
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Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Substancekill » Thu Oct 10, 2013 7:25 am


Race: Half Giant
at character creation as always set all stats to their minimum

Character Creation Runes:
Healthy as an Ox
Wizards Apprentice

Disciplines:
Huntsman
Undead Hunter

Stat Runes:
Amazing Intelligence

Stats at level 75:
Strength: 140
Dexterity: 35
Con: 130
Intelligence: 109 (Without amazing intelligence youre capped at 95. you shouldn't need anymore than this)
Spirit: 20

Skill trains: 588
by level 75 you should have these stats
Hammer: 118 trains to 156%
Great Hammer Mastery: 49 trains to 92%
Heavy Armor: 111 trains to 149%
Abjuration: 119 trains (capped) to 136%
Toughness: 70 trains to 112%

Powers and Abilities:
Pious Word of Binding - Train to max
Exalted Word of Binding - Train to max
Dangriels Might - Train to max
Consecrate weapon (Undead Hunter) 1

Gear:
Righteous Hammer (I think I had one with an Unholy proc. can't remember lol)
Sentinel Armor (full set, I usually used stuff with damage resistance buffs but you can use whatever you feel is best)
I thought I would put my sentinel build in a new thread so everyone could see it and get opinions on what I should have done to improve the build. I know a lot of people wouldn't put a whole lot of thought into using Pious word of binding for a melee sent. (At least to the best of my knowledge) but its really only there for stopping power and helps with mages/fast movers alike. but still ideas are welcome as I'd love to improve it.

cashmoneyflow
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by cashmoneyflow » Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:34 pm

Lower great hammer mastery to 70% and put hammer mastery to 70% as well, using class hammer allows you to use both mastery lines for weapon powers
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TGreg1066
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by TGreg1066 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:40 pm

I had a similar build but I took Ambi used a holy proc sent hammer and undead hunter for tier 2 and 3 holy proc. Even with moderate int I still saw massive procs along with very respectable physical damage.

I have to say that if my build and yours went toe to toe.. you would have gotten spanked... but all depends on what you're going for.

What you gain from going procs, vastly outweighs what you lose in pure physical. Just make sure to train holy resist debuff (no brainer)

There a reasonable guide for this build already in the forums though.
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Substancekill
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Substancekill » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:39 pm

cashmoneyflow wrote:Lower great hammer mastery to 70% and put hammer mastery to 70% as well, using class hammer allows you to use both mastery lines for weapon powers
I didn't know that lol. That's news to me
TGreg1066 wrote:I had a similar build but I took Ambi used a holy proc sent hammer and undead hunter for tier 2 and 3 holy proc. Even with moderate int I still saw massive procs along with very respectable physical damage.
Well with that being said, I don't recall having a whole lot of use for procs. I think this build was doing nearly 400-600 per hit in offensive stance. I used it for solo pvp and gvg but its not like I'm saying its super good. Its just okay. thats why I asked for ways to better it :P

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by TGreg1066 » Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:23 am

Substancekill wrote:
Well with that being said, I don't recall having a whole lot of use for procs. I think this build was doing nearly 400-600 per hit in offensive stance. I used it for solo pvp and gvg but its not like I'm saying its super good. Its just okay. thats why I asked for ways to better it :P

Last I remember from shadowbane.... you can't use great hammer powers with a 1 handed hammer... that was patched out in the last year or two. So i'm not sure why you were being advised to do that...

that being said I would use a minimum int value if you're not going to do SIGNIFICANT procing. Your build has far too much int... But if i wasn't going to proc I wouldn't make a sent... would make a warrior or barb. They just do the same thing better. if you really like a hybrid play style then... your build is fine ... The beta may allow the use of great hammer powers and hammer mastery powers but if so that's a bug they need to fix and was an exploit they patched out of the game.... Besides you have plenty of powers as it is without doing a second mastery. that build won't have a ton of stam you don't want to burn through it too fast.
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Beula » Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:45 am

TGreg1066 wrote:
Substancekill wrote:
Well with that being said, I don't recall having a whole lot of use for procs. I think this build was doing nearly 400-600 per hit in offensive stance. I used it for solo pvp and gvg but its not like I'm saying its super good. Its just okay. thats why I asked for ways to better it :P

Last I remember from shadowbane.... you can't use great hammer powers with a 1 handed hammer... that was patched out in the last year or two. So i'm not sure why you were being advised to do that...

that being said I would use a minimum int value if you're not going to do SIGNIFICANT procing. Your build has far too much int... But if i wasn't going to proc I wouldn't make a sent... would make a warrior or barb. They just do the same thing better. if you really like a hybrid play style then... your build is fine ... The beta may allow the use of great hammer powers and hammer mastery powers but if so that's a bug they need to fix and was an exploit they patched out of the game.... Besides you have plenty of powers as it is without doing a second mastery. that build won't have a ton of stam you don't want to burn through it too fast.
Because the sentinel hammers are abjuration based focus not hammer or great hammer. The game allows you to use 1h and 2h wpn powers. Same with the templar swords and any class based focus weapon that has both 1h and 2h counterparts.

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Substancekill » Fri Oct 11, 2013 5:47 pm

TGreg1066 wrote: Your build has far too much int...
the reason for so much int is basically for the extra atr with Abjuration trains (weapon and powers atr). I could probably do with less trains in HA and throw more into Toughness or Athletics

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by TGreg1066 » Fri Oct 11, 2013 5:53 pm

Substancekill wrote:
TGreg1066 wrote: Your build has far too much int...
the reason for so much int is basically for the extra atr with Abjuration trains (weapon and powers atr). I could probably do with less trains in HA and throw more into Toughness or Athletics
You should never do more than 100 or 110% on a non defense based heavy armor toon. It's a waste of points... yes you should put them in athletics or toughness.

as far as the weapon powers... I don't think it let you cross masterys... a burning greatsword could use great sword powers and a burning blade could use sword mastery powers...
I could be wrong obviously... it's been a while.
Last edited by TGreg1066 on Fri Oct 11, 2013 5:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by TGreg1066 » Fri Oct 11, 2013 5:56 pm

Substancekill wrote:
TGreg1066 wrote: Your build has far too much int...
the reason for so much int is basically for the extra atr with Abjuration trains (weapon and powers atr). I could probably do with less trains in HA and throw more into Toughness or Athletics

spiking atr is a waste of time with a hammer. You need to accept that you won't be able to hit a properly specced def toon. You just don't have the right weapon powers for it.

even with spiked trains and precise and weapon powers you won't have more than 1800 atr... and a good defense toon has 2k. and 90% of the time you'll be atr debuffed and have no def debuff to counter. Save the trains and accept that you're not a spec that can deal with a def toon. My two cents...
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Deathmarch » Fri Jan 03, 2014 12:20 am

Build sucks. Either go high str high con full melee or go high int high con def based.


Regardless, some tips for the future: apprentice runes (warlord's page, wizard's apprentice, etc.) are technically extremely inefficient if one of the -5s covers a stat you actually use, meaning you should only use one that removes a relevant stat if you're going for absolute max of the stat it increases. Basically, if you're not maxing int, Wizard's apprentice is a waste of stat points since it costs 13 points, when you can easily just use the more efficient in-game stat runes.

Warlord's page, however, is very efficient on every type of sentinel build, because it basically costs 8 points since you don't need spi or dex. Warlord's Page and Clever as your creation runes gives you 5 free stat points.

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Amaz » Fri Jan 03, 2014 12:55 am

You can get a stat spread of 85STR/150CON/145INT on a HG, which gives you options for something of both worlds. Your bombs are still large, you have enough stat headroom to get quite an effective defense, especially since HA and Hammer are both STR skills, and with 85STR your weapon hits are actually noticeable, especially with Dagriels Might up.
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Deathmarch » Fri Jan 03, 2014 11:14 pm

It's basically a subpar BGSlar. Is there even an abj based GH in the game?

And I haven't even going into the war crimes committed on trains for the build in the OP.

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Amaz » Fri Jan 03, 2014 11:19 pm

Deathmarch wrote:It's basically a subpar BGSlar. Is there even an abj based GH in the game?
http://morloch.shadowbaneemulator.com/i ... ous_Hammer
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Deathmarch » Fri Jan 03, 2014 11:48 pm

Honestly it would be better for me to just write up a whole new template and post it in a whole new thread than argue about anything here. Still most likely going to be a gimped BGSlar in all situations, but whatevs.

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by tooshifty » Sat Jan 04, 2014 8:43 am

Amaz wrote:You can get a stat spread of 85STR/150CON/145INT on a HG, which gives you options for something of both worlds. Your bombs are still large, you have enough stat headroom to get quite an effective defense, especially since HA and Hammer are both STR skills, and with 85STR your weapon hits are actually noticeable, especially with Dagriels Might up.
Deathmarch wrote:It's basically a subpar BGSlar. Is there even an abj based GH in the game?

And I haven't even going into the war crimes committed on trains for the build in the OP.

not gimp. You can call everything but a deflar a gimp bgs templar...templars are just...strong, because they can fly when getting ground pwned and then pwn. Its a good build and can serve a smart mans purpose. maybe u just arent looking for purpose, ur looking for 1v1.
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Deathmarch » Sat Jan 04, 2014 10:43 pm

I can't think of any GvG scenario in which a build like this would be remotely useful, so I assumed we were talking about a 1v1 toon.

Also saying this is a "good build"...I could literally write a 3 page essay on everything wrong with this particular build posted by the OP, but I really don't care enough to go over character building 101. If people want to make useless gimp toons with hundreds of wasted trains, that's their business.

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Deathmarch » Sat Jan 04, 2014 10:52 pm

Anyways if you can come up with a good argument for when this would be useful over an actual good toon (or even a normal sent build) I'll cede the argument, but the burden of proof is on you since it's a lot easier for you to provie that info than it is for me to go over all the possible scenarios in which this type of toon is subpar.

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Amaz » Sat Jan 04, 2014 11:26 pm

WTF! I didn't say anything about a great hammer sentinel. I said you could get good defense, good hp, nice damage and being stun and powerblock immune when in mattered on a HG.

Basically build like a normal defensive human sentinel but accept 15 less INT as a good trade for toughness, better con, immunities etc. Plus with a moderate STR you get the additional bonus of your 1h sentinel hammer hitting for noticeable amounts of damage even if your procs dont come off.
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Deathmarch » Sat Jan 04, 2014 11:38 pm

I was talking to tooshifty, but besides that, why are you arguing with me when my first post in this thread was me saying to either go int/con or str/con?

And besides THAT, anything over 125 int is unnecessary no matter what kind of sentinel you're building, unless it's for a suicide telebomb spec.

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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by tooshifty » Sun Jan 05, 2014 7:36 am

Deathmarch wrote:I can't think of any GvG scenario in which a build like this would be remotely useful, so I assumed we were talking about a 1v1 toon.

Also saying this is a "good build"...I could literally write a 3 page essay on everything wrong with this particular build posted by the OP, but I really don't care enough to go over character building 101. If people want to make useless gimp toons with hundreds of wasted trains, that's their business.
ya, im not sure i was reading attentively when i posted that. i know for sure the creator of this topic's build needs a lot of tweeking. I was thinking armoz's build..then i read and it may not be so awsome....but regardless hg sentinals do have a purpose. I mean go high con meatshield debuff in a holy group. Or the less desired def horse build.
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Re: Half Giant - Sentinel

Post by Deathmarch » Sun Jan 05, 2014 4:02 pm

LOL. I think I get what happened here. I said a GH sentinel meaning Great Hammer sentinel would be a poor man's BGSlar. I was talking about the weapon choice, not race choice.

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